Cars

I think we all agree that it's time to stop running cars on gasoline. But what is the best alternative fuel? Diesel is not much - if any - better. But diesel engines can be adapted to run on used cooking oil. This would seem ideal, but if all vehicles switched over, would there be enough oil for everyone?
Electricity is becoming more popular. But what if we all switched to electric cars: wouldn't we have to produce a lot more electricty? How would we do that? Building more coal plants would just take us from the frying pan into the fire. As for nuclear plants, in addition to the risk of nuclear plants themselves, they produce dangerous waste material that we are currently sweeping under the carpet because we don't know what to do with it. As for building more hydroelectric power stations, well, damming rivers and flooding huge ecosystems hardly seems to be the way to go green.
Ethanol has been gaining popularity. But it takes more energy to produce than it delivers. And already there is concern about what we are going to eat as farmland is being used to grow plants for fuel. But there's a variation on ethanol that could be just the ticket: cellulosic ethanol. This is fuel made from the leftover parts of plants that are already being grown for food.

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"The monkeys are throwing stuff at me again."
-Survivorman in Costa Rica

In class we studied alternative fuels. They said that if we all switched to electricity there would be 50% less greenhouse gas emisions, despite the fact that more energy would be produced. You would also be able to employ more renewable sources of energy. As for the ethanol and biodiesel they make the case that people would be selling their crops to fuel companies while food prices go up, and poor people starve. Also people are plowing over rainforests just to plant more fuel crops. Sad

There is also fuel cells which I think would be good too. They still have a long ways to go on that though. Confused

I think my favorite concept was a car that runs on compressed air. Razz

It works just like an internal combustion engine but with air.
The other issue wasn't just type of fuel, but how big our cars are. If we cut the weight they can go much farther. They made a carbon fiber car that was consumer priced, and was very strong. As far as I see it we wont see drastic changes for a while. I think the closest ther is right now would be hybrids. Cool

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One thing to keep in mind when considering alternative fuels is not just the lower emissions from the vehicle, but what emissions, energy, etc. are involved in producing the fuel.
Making lighter cars is one way to reduce the amount of whatever fuel is used. Carbon fibre (lighter than aluminum, stronger than steel) is coming down in price to the point where it will soon be practical to use in an average priced car. It would help if we could get people out of their SUV's. If you go off the beaten path, then fine, get the 4x4. But don't get one just to keep up with the neighbours. Some people buy them because they feel safe in them, but they're misguided. They don't allow you to avoid an accident as well as in a car because they don't handle or brake as well as a car. And they are built more solid than an car, so they don't have the crumple zones built in to absorb impact energy in case of a crash.

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"The monkeys are throwing stuff at me again."
-Survivorman in Costa Rica

Right now I believe a Diesel - Electric hybrid is the best for our current time.

Sure i'd love it if they made hydrogen fuel cell powerd cars but apprently that's too expensive. I guess the priorities are money to some people

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"There dosen't look like there's much shelter over in those mountains, but that's the only choice I got right now, this is gonna be a long week" - Les Stroud Arctic

	TrooperMax wrote:
	Right now I believe a Diesel - Electric hybrid is the best for our current time. Sure i'd love it if they made hydrogen fuel cell powerd cars but apprently that's too expensive. I guess the priorities are money to some people

I think I've seen new deisel engines that that put into cars that get really good gas mileage, like 90 or so, and they're silent like a gas engine. Razz

Those would be awsome to have too.

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Hydrogen fuel cells are almost on the market actually, I believe one of the major car companies in America plans to have one out in the next few years. Right now Hybrids are the way to go, or electric if you only go short distances in my opinion. It doesn't require much change and is more efficient. But the best solutions are to go smaller and lighter, unfortunately we also need drivers to become safer, so many people feel that their car has to be faster than other peoples and they have to prove it. This among other factors makes it difficult to make cars lighter. Many companies tried going with plastics and fiberglass to lighten cars up, but some stopped because when the cars were in accidents, the results were not very good. Driver responsibility, I think, would vastly improve our current situation. If that means that people have to do more than just a 5 hour course a written exam and a 15 minute driving exam, so be it (New York State Standards). In Europe, many countries have a mandatory 6 months of driving with a licensed instructor before you can get your license, and the road test is A LOT more difficult, maybe we should start doing the same over here.

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We only have one Earth, take care of her and she will take care of you. ~ probably someone else

Eventually, drivers will be removed from the equation. That's right, driving a vehicle will become a thing of the past and we will all be passengers. There are presently prototype highways being tested where on board computers are told the destination and off the car goes, with the occupants not having to lift a finger. It's not that far in the future. Look at how many things now are controlled by a computer on a car. Some manufacturers even have cruise control that slows the car if someone pulls in front of you, then gets you back up to your cruising speed once the way is clear.
Once they start converting roads and cars to automation, no more driving as we know it. Enjoy it while it lasts.
Future generations won't know the kick of seeing the speedometer hit the ton (and I mean mph, not kph) in a '73 Plymouth Fury with a big enough V8 to spin the rear wheels via an auto tranny. Sigh.

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"The monkeys are throwing stuff at me again."
-Survivorman in Costa Rica

Getting back to fuel: There is something that can meet all our energy needs, and it's free for the taking. All we have to do is somehow come up with political and industry leaders who will work on better ways to harness this energy. It's the sun. Solar panels have been developed to the point where they are sort of practical for houses. It still takes a long time to recover the cost, but that will come down. But for cars, solar is still in the stone age. Cars have been built that can run on solar. But they can carry only the weight of the batteries and the driver, and the entire top of the car is covered with expensive, fragile solar panels. Enough of these vehicles have been built (mostly by universities) that races have been held for them on roads in sunny places like Australia. They are nowhere near ready for even limited consumer products. let alone mass production. But it provides a hint at what could be if we got serious about developing solar.

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"The monkeys are throwing stuff at me again."
-Survivorman in Costa Rica

I have heard about the prototype cars, use magnets in the roads to stay between the lines and gps to navigate. Also allows the cars to maintain much smaller distance between which improves gas mileage like nascar. Only real problem I see with them is if an animal suddenly appears on the road, will the cars sensors recognize it and take appropriate action in time, or will roadkill rates increase until animals learn? I mean computers recognize way faster than we do, but what will it do? how will it respond?

I do believe that both hybrids and electrical cars are being outfitted with small solar panels to help charge the batteries, it doesn't do much, but slows the rate at which your battery drains on nice days, every bit helps. Solar power in general needs to have more research done, solar panels aren't very efficient in their current state and are delicate, we need more efficient, more robust panels, that are hopefully cheap to manufacture.

We know how Photosynthesis works in plants, I wonder if we can develop a solar based system that works similar to that to produce energy

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We only have one Earth, take care of her and she will take care of you. ~ probably someone else

^ I've seen deer sensors when I was driving through Indiana, and Ohio. They have lazers on the side of the road, and when something breaks the lazer the warning lights go on. We already have the technology for that part.

I've seen on tv that they can make way better solar panels, but it's very difficult. That sort of think is kind of when you're getting into nano machines. Shocked

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Transportation is responsible for more than 27 per cent of Canada's total greenhouse gas emissions. Unless we reverse some of the following trends in vehicle use, transportation emissions will continue to rise.
Canadian vehicle ownership per capita is now double what it was in 1960.

The number of kilometres driven per capita is now double 1960 levels in Canada.

At the same time, freight has shifted from fuel-efficient rail to gas-guzzling trucks.

Vehicle fuel efficiency standards have not improved since the mid-1980s.

The single biggest source of the massive increase in greenhouse gas emissions in transportation are passenger vehicles - cars and light-duty trucks. The popularity of sports utility vehicles, trucks and minivans, which now account for 50 per cent of new vehicles sales, has had a highly negative impact on average fuel efficiency.

The David Suzuki Foundation proposes the following measures to reduce transportation emissions:

Improve mandatory fuel economy standards for vehicles to reduce both greenhouse gas emissions and air pollution.

Gradually introduce tax increases on gasoline and diesel to reflect their real environmental and health costs. European transportation fuels cost two to three times more than Canada's, and consumption is one third less. Over the long term such taxes encourage the purchase of fuel-efficient vehicles and reduce unneccesary driving. Tax income should support transportation alternatives such as efficient, convenient transit and bicycle infrastructure while allowing reductions to sales, payroll or income taxes.

Strengthen support for public transit, car pool programs, cycling infrastructure and other sustainable transport options.

Require a mandatory renewable energy content of five per cent, such as lignocellulosic ethanol (made from straw, corn husks, forest residue, etc.), to replace some of the gasoline Canadians use.

Lower and enforce speed limits to reduce fuel consumption. There is an enormous increase in fuel use at higher speeds.

Encourage the movement of freight by rail rather than by road, as rail is much more fuel efficient.

Encourage Canadians to consider a hybrid vehicle when buying a new car. The 2004 Toyota Prius, for example, uses just 4.1 litres of gas to travel 100 kilometres, twice the mileage of passenger cars in its class.
While fuel cells are touted as the pollution-free power source for automobiles, some fuel cell processes (i.e. those that use fossil fuels to produce hydrogen) result in greenhouse gas emissions. Fuel cells have tremendous potential, but only if their fuel source provides the best options for carbon dioxide reductions. Cool

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A Knifeless Man is a Lifeless Man
Canadian To The Core
We are Known By The Tracks we Leave Behind
Carry Less by Knowing More
Knowledge Weighs Nothing

I can't say my Touareg V10 is helping Embarassed

but I walk when it's only 1 or 2 miles instead of driving, it saves me a few bucks, and its healthier for me and the environment Very Happy

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	SHoGuNN3R_l33t_5uShI™ wrote:
	but I walk when it's only 1 or 2 miles instead of driving,

Good for you Gunn3r. Many people, as soon as they get a car, drive absolutely everywhere, even a block or so.

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"The monkeys are throwing stuff at me again."
-Survivorman in Costa Rica

How a Hybrid Car works. For those who aren't sure. Cool

http://video.google.ca/videosearch?q=Hybrid+cars&hl=en&sitesearch=

_________________
A Knifeless Man is a Lifeless Man
Canadian To The Core
We are Known By The Tracks we Leave Behind
Carry Less by Knowing More
Knowledge Weighs Nothing

Cool.

Personally I love driving and I would be disapointed if my car drove for me. For long distance on the highway, sure it would be nice. Otherwise I can drive myself.

Someone mentioned earlier that drivers are also a big problem, I totally agree. In my town the problem isnt fast drivers, its slow/stupid drivers. people drive The speed limit or below. Sounds good? I dont think so, because these are the drivers that cause traffic and accidents. YES accidents, why you may ask? Well these people have NO reflexes whatsoever. Being too aggresive is bad when driving but being too tame is bad too. When something happnes you have to react and I'm seen people just keep driving and crash. There are many easily avoidable situations. THis is just very general, there are many factors, but slow drivers are just as bad as fast drivers. People who speed are stupid too, I drive 10-20km over the speed limit (20 on the highway 10-15 on roads under 80) which most people do. People who driver faster than that are just stupid (Unless everyone is going the same speed, always go with the flow). I believe the most dangerous thing is slow drivers on the highway. I've seend people driver 20km UNDER the speed limit on the highway, very easy to crash into them.

Ok enough of my rant, I can talk driving all day, then again I used to be a racecar driver.

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"There dosen't look like there's much shelter over in those mountains, but that's the only choice I got right now, this is gonna be a long week" - Les Stroud Arctic

I couldn't agree more with you, Troop. Especially as we live in the same place. The slow drivers SUCK. I'm sorry, when it's 60 and they're going 40??

Then you go to a city like Toronto and they drive like maniacs. I cannot stand driving there, I've driven in several big cities such as NYC, Boston, Nashville, even Vegas and hands down Toronto is the worst. I have a friend who agrees with me, she hates driving in that city as well.

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^ Lol, Troop/Steph; This has what to do with Hybrid Cars ??? Confused

......... isnt there a Pet peeves thread Wink

_________________
A Knifeless Man is a Lifeless Man
Canadian To The Core
We are Known By The Tracks we Leave Behind
Carry Less by Knowing More
Knowledge Weighs Nothing

	Drummer Dave wrote:
	^ Lol, Troop/Steph; This has what to do with Hybrid Cars ??? ......... isnt there a Pet peeves thread

You're right! Laughing

http://fourseasonssurv.s3.bizhat.com/viewtopic.php?t=257&start=0

I didn't even know that one existed. Cool

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	Stephanie wrote:
	hands down Toronto is the worst.

I have no choice but to drive in Toronto, since that's where I live. Rather then take offense at your evaluation, Steph, I agree that this city has some awful drivers. It's as a pedestrian and a cyclist that I notice it the most. I have almost been hit a number of times because some drivers just think about themselves and ignore the fact that if they're turning, pedestrians going straight have the right of way.

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"The monkeys are throwing stuff at me again."
-Survivorman in Costa Rica

Sorry to offend, Bushrat (and take the thread off topic). That's just my observation of driving in numerous big cities. My father in law is rather proud of it (he's up there with maniac drivers on the 401).

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